But there all sorts of misunderstandings/problems in your comment. For one, no one (at least not I or most of the women here) believe in “groveling at your husband’s feet”. Perhaps, since you feel like *we* misunderstand the definition of feminism, you can relate to the frustration of being so misquoted and misunderstood.

Those of us who believe in BIBLICAL explanations of marital roles believe in equality and agree with you that Jesus was the first liberator of women. But, equality doesn’t negate roles, or demean anyone in those roles.

A different role in marriage doesn’t make me less or my husband more. At all. In fact, according to Scripture, husbands have the more “demeaning” role if there is such. He is called to lay down his life daily for his wife–a sacrificial role that, by default, elevates his wife. That’s certainly not the “groveling” you have in mind.

Also, your definition of feminism is a broad, general one that most people like to think, but the TRUTH is, and if you would study it you’d know, that feminism can’t stop there to be effective. Even secular, former feminists attest to the damage done to families and society, in general, because of the precipitating factors involved in the whole of the feminist movement.

It’s a fact, as far as I am concerned, and cannot be reasoned away.

She is the warmest, most sunshine-y person I know, I remember getting a million hugs from her when we were little kids, she was *always* there for us when we needed her, she and Dad came to every school event, sat through endless sobfests during our awkward teenage years . . .

Man, I could go on for hours. We were truly lucky kids.

Try telling my mom, who raised three strong, happy, successful kids, has an amazing marriage of 25+ years, and has always worked 40+ hours in a position of leadership outside the home, that she is “anti-family.”

My brothers and I (I’m a woman, btw) respect and admire her strength and her intelligence. Her example–and our dad’s support and respect for her (and his own hard work, of course)–has made all three of us better partners in our own relationships.

If our mom had *chosen* to work at home, whether as a homemaker or as a self-employed person, because that’s what made her happy, I’m dead certain that we would have admired her equally. Because in that scenario, Mom would still be showing us that she values her own needs and desires, and acts accordingly.

There is nothing instrinsically “female” about putting one’s own needs dead last. Many feminists need and love raising children and being in long-term, committed relationships, and they make it work.

And by the way, here’s what feminism really means: Feminism is the radical notion that women are human beings.

IMHO, we all lose when we get lost in a pointless discussion about whether or not “men and women are the same.” Not all men are exactly the same as each other, to begin with! Not all women have exactly the same needs and desires!

We are all human beings, with an astonishing diversity of needs, desires, and abilities.

Elizabeth,

You said, ““Those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.” I really can’t get over the irony of that statement.
I guess then that none of us deserve liberty or security, because most women submit to someone. The working woman SUBMITS to an employer who does not love her. Therefore losing way more liberty than this home-maker! I was in the corporate world for several years; I know.

We all submit whether we will admit it or not. I choose the guy who loves me and doesn’t smother my freedom.